Sunday, 24 January 2016

The Irminic-Kristianity of Wiligut in Opposition to the Wotanism of Guido von List

The teachings of Karl Maria Wiligut are complex and must be treated with great caution by the novice for in many ways they conflict with-or appear to conflict with the teachings of the Master Guido von List. Therefore it is adviseable that when reading Wiligut's work one first has a basic appreciation and understanding of the works of Guido von List.

Willigut claimed that List owed his ideas and concepts to him but there is no evidence for this. Indeed I am of the opinion that on the contrary Wiligut either relied upon the teachings of List or developed his own concepts in isolation from him. Adolf Schleipfer, the Grand Master of the Armanen Order (re-established by him in 1976) writing in Irminsul No 5 in 1982 (republished as Appendix D in The Secret King. The Myth and Reality of Nazi Occultism, Stephen E. Flowers and Michael Moynihan):

"Briefly summarized, it can be said of the Wiligut-tradition that one of its most important criteria is that there was-according to this tradition-a primordial Kristendom with a plan for human elevation or evolution. (This is differentiated from Christendom, which came about millenia later, by being spelled with a 'K.') The representatives of this were called the 'Irmin-faithful' while those who were against this plan of cross-breeding were called 'Wotanists.'"
If List was dependent or even just familiar with Wiligut's traditions then it is strange that he makes no reference to them:

"If List was not only schooled in these matters of the Wiligut-traditions, but was also even supposed to have made them part of the results of his own research, then it seems completely incomprehensible that List nowhere even in the slightest mentions these Wiligut-traditions, especially not the 'Kristur-Plan'! Indeed, how can some sort of collaboration between List and Wiligut be conceived of, when the latter was a decided opponent of Wotanism?"

Certain Masters of the Armanist tradition and also academics such as Professor Bernhard Kummer regard Odin/Woden/Wodan/Wotan as a foreign and thus alien deity adopted by the Germanic peoples at a later date (See Midgards Untergang). This idea is also maintained by certain scholars and Germanic heathens today. I must point out that this is not my position, nor that of Woden's Folk. Wiligut's and Kummer's position on Wotan  is in stark contrast with Guido von List's, the founding father of Armanism who in Herr Schleipfer's words:

"....establishes the DIVINE IMAGE OF WOTAN in his cosmological descriptions in his works: e.g., 1) Das Geheimnis der Runen, 2) in his Religion der Ario-Germanen, and 3) in his Bilderschaft der Ario-Germanen and its comprehensive and fundamental meaning in the Germanic cosmology and theogony."

It is of course possible as Herr Schleipfer admits that both Wiligut and List developed their theories and concepts from a common Germanic tradition and that both parties focused on a particular aspect of this. Whilst not commonly known those of us who are involved in folkish Wodenism do accept the concept of a Krist but not one who is in oppostion to Woden! Despite the apparent anti-Wotanist slant to Wiligut's teachings there is much in the Wiligut-tradition which we can adapt and utilise in Wodenism and I will be doing just that in forthcoming articles on this blog.

It should be noted that another Armanist Master, Ernst Lauterer (Tarnhari-Hidden Lord) was a Wotanist who made himself known to Guido von List. Tarnhari claimed to be a direct descendant of the Volsungs (as is my daughter) and of the clan of Wodan. It is claimed that Wiligut had Tarnhari as well as the runologist Friedrich Bernhard Marby consigned to a concentration camp. According to Nicholas Goodrich-Clarke in The Occult Roots of Nazism. Secret Aryan Cults and their influence on Nazi Ideology:

".....Tarnhari popularized List's ideas during the war...." (page 46) 
 This was no doubt the motive; Tarnhari was a supporter of the Wotanist philosopy of List. In fact after the flight of renowned occultist Rudolf Hess there was a general crackdown on all forms of occultic practices and reading matter. Hess was the restraining hand and power that kept these repressive measures from occurring. Indeed Wiligut could have had some connection with Hess's capture and arrest as apparently Hess sought contact with relatives of Tarnhari living in England. Certainly the British security services were expecting him. However I repeat that this is conjecture. As occultists and folkish ones at that we must consider what would have happened to us if we were alive and living in Germany at that time! A sobering thought but we must be honest about this and not look through every aspect of the Third Reich through rose-tinted spectacles!


Joe Sevnson said...

It is hard to believe that this is still necessary:
Yes, Guido List and Karl Wiligut both acquired their wisdom in the same manner as the ‘Knowing ones’ of the past and just as the Arman still receives it today. It is an ancient line of wisdom and tradition that goes all the way back to the beginning and comes from He who is the beginning. There was not a problem between List and Wiligut, both had a part to play and each knew it. They were both Armanen (Irminen), the Tree, the Arman-sal, the Axis – this is Arman (Irmin) and what the Hagall Rune demonstrates. A stone grew inside a spring, Urda’s well, and rose into a mighty Tree from which through it stock resurrected a Sun, an Arman, a Hero (stock and stone) – Urda and the Godman and both part of the Tree – Arman-en.
Von List did not invent the Armanen nor did he invent the Armanen Rune Row, nor did Wiligut invent his Rune Row, they were both part of an ancient tradition. The Armanen are the great Sages, the Hyperborean wisdom of the past; the wisdom of Ar-man. The Armanen are those of the Halgadom rings, the Holy Acht, the Knights, the Vehm, the Thinge, the Singers, the GermanenOrden, the SS, a Black Stone from which an Axis Power grew and so on, all of which are inseparable from the Graal Mythos – they are one and the same.
The Rune Row, named in honor of the Arman, is Wotans Rune Song from the Havamal. It is in respect to that moment of Arman Conciousness, frozen in time, that we honor the sacred 18, although there are numerous other Runes and all of the past Masters had been quite aware of these facts. Wotan’s Rune Song when ‘He sacrifices Himself to Himself, High above’ – to Arman. The Wotanist sees only Wotan, just as the Christian sees only Christ, while both were sacrificing themselves to Arman, the Tree, the Whole. “wither He came, thither He returns”. The Armanen sees the Tree. The Armanen seeks to become Wotan and also retrieve the Runes from Arman; become the Hero from the Tree – the ‘Tree of Terror’ as Serrano rightly called it, but it is also the Tree of Life, the World Tree that all of creation is within its branches; Yggdrasil, Arman, God. The arising, being and passing away – all of this is happening in the Tree – the rotation - the Tree of Life. Wotan and Kristos are both part of the Tree and so are you and I, and the Tree is Ar-man; the source of Wotan and the source of Kristos, the source of We. There is no argument – only those who do not know. There is no argument – only the Tree. And the Tree has a consciousness, a Personality, the Absolute Personality and He is Arman-en. He has so many names – Wotan, Tuisto, Kristos and so on. The last Godman of Arman was Adolf Hitler. The Vehm had even called the Irminsul Mary’s Pillar, List would have probably preferred St. Stephen’s Tower – can’t you see it was always the Tree, Who is Arman.
I do not know why you insist upon dragging out these kosher sources of materials – the Ed Thorsens and Goodlick-clarks have no place in the Armanen. Their subtle lies have been thrown on their ear in the last few years and still you insist on pushing their agenda. Schleipfer, who like you, is not an Amanen but only pretends to be one. Marby was a complete punk. I do not know enough about Tarnhari, but neither do you. We do not understand how with so much information out there and plenty by the old Arman Rune Masters themselves, that you prefer to cuddle up with kosher stamped sources. Why do you try to mislead others?
And the reason ‘esoteric orders’ were banned after the flight of Rudolf Hess is because they were full of spies, sellouts and traitors. The final straw for that espionage (golden dawn oto freemasons) was the loss of Hess. Damn straight the Godmen banned all of them kosher bastards – and not one of those kosher lames was an Armanen. And most of your sources would surely have been found not to be trusted. They were/are untrustworthy men, much less trustworthy sources. You must stop trying to mislead others or your ‘creativity’ will suffer even worse. I forgive you, now you must forgive yourself.

Wotans Krieger said...

Edred Thorsson/Stephen Edred Flowers PhD was the first scholar in the English speaking world to translate important Armanist texts such as Das Geheimnis Der Runen (The Secret of the Runes (1988)-surely you must have a copy of this groundbreaking work translated by him on your shelves?, Die Religion der Ario-Germanen in ihrer Esoterik und Exoterik (The Religion of the Aryo-Germanic Folk. Esoteric and Exoteric) (2005), Der Unbesiegbare (The Invincible) (1996), Peryt Shou's The Edda as Key to the Coming Age (2004) and Runen Magie (Rune Magic) by Siegfried Adolf Kummer (1993). What about Rune Might.Secret Practices of the German Rune Magicians (1989), a vital exposition of the Armanen Runes and probably his most important original work? This is of course all in addition to The Secret King. Karl Maria Wiligt. Himmler's Lord of the Runes (2001), later expanded and renamed The Secret King. The Myth and Reality of Nazi Occultism (2007).
Thorsson's works repeatedly show a Listian influence, especially in the concept of ARISING-BECOMING-PASSING AWAY-NEW ARISING. He has met with modern day German Rune Masters and to say that his works are 'kosher' is to discredit this great man.
You call Marby a 'punk'!I have his voluminous works on my shelves and if you take the trouble to read them in their original German you will come to appreciate the depths of this man's wisdom and understanding. Why do you shame him so?
Herr Schleipfer is folkish and resurrected the Guido von List Society in 1967, the Armanen Order in 1976 and the High Armanen Order. He is the founder of the Armanen Verlag publishing house responsible for publishing all of the works of Guido von List in their original German and I have a number of these books on my shelves, so again why do you discredit this great man and attack others who mean you no ill will?
I, myself have purchased every single one of your books apart from your latest SS Family translation as I have Ulrich of England's already. I recognise the great work that you have been doing the last few years and nobody is critical of your mission, least of all myself so you need to stop looking for enemies where none exist and recognise those things that unite awakened Aryans rather than divide them. Our numbers are far too small as it is for any childish and immature in-fighting. You also must learn to respect others' opinions even if you disagree with them as this is the Aryan way, the noble way of the best of our folk!
No man should be dogmatic and say 'this and only this is THE way' for that is the tactic of the supporters of the Abrahamic religions. Aryo-Germanic man must be free in mind, body and spirit.

Joe Sevnson said...

Ok. Perhaps we should slow it down a bit. First and foremost I have never said “this is the only way”. There is nothing wrong with being a Wotanist or whatever else one may call upon if it brings out the best in that Aryan Soul. The problem is when those whose vision is limited have the idea to argue with those who see – here is where the road of error begins and has begun again and again and again. Such as the kosher version of the Initiates of The Third Reich that has been put forth for the English speaking world in the last couple of decades or so. It is all in the name of confusion. They give a little piece here and throw a little dig there and so on, yet never coming close to the miraculous Spirit of those men. What had been presented was a book with most of the pages missing. That has changed in the last few years, yet you seem to be intent upon still presenting those Armanen thru a broken mirror. And believe me – it is certainly a kosher version of events.

You are correct that I was too angry in my initial response. It is true that I do not know Herr Schleipfer and should not have been so rash. I have only seen his criticisms of the Colonel and found it very disappointing and surely the outlook of a Wotanist rather than a True Armanen, and that is fine, but they shouldn’t say that they are an Armanen when they are a Wotanist. List also had a strong Wotanist leaning, but the old Meister was, of course, wise enough to give all reverence to the old sages, the Kalanden, the Acht, the Armanen. The Irminen.
Dr. Flowers is another story altogether – yes, he has put out the hard work of translations and some of them mighty helpful and to be commended, but again, he is not an Armanen and cannot truly comprehend the Spirit and Honor of the Arman. Thus, he is no source for the workings of the Armanen. Goodrich-Clark (ad nausea) I will say it again – these promoters of the ‘Magical Third Reich’ were showing us a broken mirror. The picture is being made whole so that it makes Aryan sense now and not the kosher filtered version that we had been so graciously presented in the past. And Folks like Marby were untrustworthy, period.

As for you personally, I have never wished you ill, but you called me everything but a white man a few books back and that’s fine, except that now you act shocked by my frankness. We have periodically followed your site since, hoping that the Old Man shines his light upon you – so, that you might drop some of your dissention and so on. But then I stopped by the other day and found that you were still pushing the kosher version of events. Do you know who you are talking about when you lay deception and espionage at the Colonel’s feet? This was a highly decorated Officer who was renowned for his Honor and Dignity and you espouse that he had men put into camps because of personal or petty reasons. Never happened! Damn straight that makes me angry when you insist upon that kosher make believe. You can insult me WK but please don’t insult the Colonel. These men were Kamerads, all serving the same Spirit, and as men of destiny they all knew it. They damn bled together – Gorseleben and Eckhart were held captive together by the communists, the Colonel had close contact with the Guido von List Society, Herr Stauff knew everyone, etc. So, to keep trumpeting the old jewish dissention line is disappointing. We are currently working on a translation of someone who the agents of darkness have tried hard to leave behind the curtain. And once again, his work will show everyone how these men (Meister List, the Colonel and others) were together on everything and certainly not against each other.

I wish you the best, because as you know, we are also led by the same Spirit, too many synchronicities not to be. We are drawn to many obscure things at the same time. We are part of the same wave. Please Brother, try to understand the dis-service that you are doing to these Men of Honor when you speak in these ways.

Wotans Krieger said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Wotans Krieger said...

Typo, hence the deletion of my previous comment.
I eagerly look forward to your forthcoming publications Joe. Your efforts in making available Master Serrano's work in English is a great blessing to those of us who appreciate his divinely inspired words.

Joe Sevnson said...

Thank you. And I do apologize for being rash. This could very well be the last time that I speak on a forum. God bless your work - you have done much good and thank you. 88